Helping rules question

A place to discuss the finer points of the mechanics and rules for the Coyote & Crow RPG.
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bridgeweaver
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Dec 26, 2021 1:15 am

Helping rules question

Post by bridgeweaver »

I've looked through the core book a couple of times now, and I don't see any rules for helping. If I haven't missed it, then here's my proposal for this mechanic.
If a character wishes to help another character in a task, the player will explain how the character is helping, and the Story Guide will assign a roll that fits the description. Successes gained by the helper will reduce the SN for the primary character on a one-for-one basis. (or) Successes become extra dice to add to the primary character's dice pool.
I'm not sure which is better balanced. I would say that failure means the helping attempt has no effect, and additional characters after the first would be at increased SN's +1 for the second +2 for the third, etc. Critical failure in a helping effort would either remove dice or increase the SN of the primary character's roll.
I think the SN is more consistent with the guidance given about using SN's rather than modifying the number of dice in the pool, but I worry that this makes helping really powerful, since the difference between rolling on an 8 SN vs. a 5 SN is quite significant. I'd be interested in opinions or a rules clarification from C&C folx.
Since this is my first post, thank you for making this game; my family and I are looking forward to playing it and learning from the assumption-questioning this will involve.
smilinirish
Posts: 33
Joined: Mon Oct 11, 2021 4:38 pm

Re: Helping rules question

Post by smilinirish »

My opinion is that lowering the TN is too strong. It increases the chance that larger dice pools gain too large an increase. I’ve been pondering this point as well, and think that helping should need to really make sense. I’m leaning toward a 1:1 success:extra dice, or even 2 successes for extra dice in the pool. Crit fail increases TN by 1. I’d also require the skill to be trained to offer help, and the number of dice added is maxed at the lower of the two characters rank in the skill.

I’m not a probabilities guy, so I can’t lay out the numbers, but that’s what I’ve been leaning towards recommending to our story guide. This system is really geared to help the players gain success. With the focus mechanic, players should already be succeeding when it really matters
bridgeweaver
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Dec 26, 2021 1:15 am

Re: Helping rules question

Post by bridgeweaver »

We've now played two sessions, and I experimented with both variations above, and agree that both are too powerful. Some of this is the chunkiness of the resolution of the system; small bonuses have outsized effects. I might try something like: if a character wishes to help another, they state how they will do so and the Story Guide will tell them what skill to use. If the character has no ranks in the skill, their help has no effect. If they have ranks <= to primary charactter's ranks (round up) primary gets 1 additional die in the pool. If they the helping character has ranks > primary character's ranks/2 (round up) this becomes two dice.
I settled on dice because the effect seemed a little less extreme than modifying SN. I'll try this next session. Character cooperation appears to be a major value behind the design for C&C, so I want to have a solid helping mechanic. I'll report back.
smilinirish
Posts: 33
Joined: Mon Oct 11, 2021 4:38 pm

Re: Helping rules question

Post by smilinirish »

Awesome. Thanks for sharing your experience. Changing SN seemed obviously powerful. Adding dice less so. But it seems multiple dice may he too much too
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